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  1. #16781
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Digger View Post
    People who sit in their cars while parked with the engine running. And then complain about the price of fuel!
    Or the ones in our road who come out of their house, start the engine, have a long hands free conversation (audible 1/4 mile away) then stop the engine, lock the car and go back inside!

  2. #16782
    Nicotine, valium, vicodin... notdeadyet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finless View Post
    Or, perhaps they feel that they were lied to by 'the man' (other genders be they real or self identified are may obviously be 'the man' should they feel represented by the generic term for person(s) in power) and humans have now to live with covid the same as with influenza (or some variation of that theme) and 2 years were wasted and lives adversely affected in many other ways.
    Who lied to them? A cabal of Chinese mask manufacturers? As far as I've read, the scientific community is still broadly in agreement over the use of masks. The masks that most people wore were pointless but that's a different argument.

    In two years a new virus was identified, studied, its genome sequenced, its behaviour understood, new anti-virals developed and at least half a dozen vaccines brought to market. That's an interesting definition of "wasted". It's easy to use hindsight and poke holes in the response but equally decisions were being made without the information available now. As a non-scientist it certainly looks like what was wasted was the efforts of science and medicine by government.

    If anyone lied it was a government that spent billions on a test & trace agency that could neither test nor trace. That sent infected people into care homes which led to the needless deaths of thousands. That appointed a health secretary whose only achievement in life was developing the financial instruments that caused the 2008 crash. That wasted tax-payers' money on a dining out scheme that was clearly aimed at forcing herd immunity but instead just caused needless misery. That made their friends and families rich off fake procurement contracts. The list is endless. And then there are the media outlets like the Mail and GB News, and popular crackpots like Neil Oliver that did their absolute best at spreading paranoia and fear. Between them all they did more damage to the public understanding of science than the mediaeval Popes. And just like the 2008 crash, no-one will ever face any comeuppance for manipulating and profiting from the situation.
    Caliph Hamish Aw-Michty Ay-Ya-Bastard, Spiritual leader of Scottish State in England

  3. #16783
    Prior Member Tim Digger's Avatar
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    I have to say I don't think the decision to urgently discharge elderly people who were mainly awaiting the glacial progress of the social care packages was incorrect, placing any requirement before discharge especially one with ,at the time, limited availability would have continued the situation of no beds available for a significant time, and would have contributed to deaths in corridors and ambulances of those needing urgent care for acute severe covid. The spectre of an overwhelmed NHS was very real and terrifying at the time. That it resulted in infections being brought into residential homes was very sad and not helped by overly stringent belated barrier provisions preventing last moments of farewell. Greatest good greatest number But we were very near the brink.
    Last edited by Tim Digger; 12-07-2022 at 11:25 AM.
    Evolution is great at solving problems. It's the methods that concern me.
    Tim Digger

  4. #16784
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Digger View Post
    I have to say I don't think the decision to urgently discharge elderly people who were mainly awaiting the glacial progress of the social care packages was incorrect, placing any requirement before discharge especially one with ,at the time, limited availability would have continued the situation of no beds available for a significant time, and would have contributed to deaths in corridors and ambulances of those needing urgent care for acute severe covid. The spectre of an overwhelmed NHS was very real and terrifying at the time. That it resulted in infections being brought into residential homes was very sad and not helped by overly stringent belated barrier provisions preventing last moments of farewell. Greatest good greatest number But we were very near the brink.
    Somewhat ironic that one of candidates for Tory leadership is the man who was in charge when they did the Potential Pandemic "run through" and was also in post selling off the warehouse containing our PPE...(of couse all out of date!). He was also the longest serving Health Minister who maybe could have done a better job of sorting out the Social Care and Hospital issues before we were hit by the fluid brown liquid!

  5. #16785
    Established TDF Member Energy58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notdeadyet View Post
    If anyone lied it was a government that spent billions on a test & trace agency that could neither test nor trace.
    I think that was the most ridiculous waste of money in the whole thing - pure COVID theatre driven by "we must be seen to do something" (something we can report on in the daily dose of doom presser) egged on by the press and the BBC. The only testing worth a damn was that done properly by/for National Statistics which was actually all that was needed because there were no treatments available for anyone with mild symptoms and if you got to the point of needing oxygen it was pretty safe to assume you had it!

  6. #16786
    Established TDF Member Chrisch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Energy58 View Post
    I think that was the most ridiculous waste of money in the whole thing - ...
    You might think that but the people that pocketed the money would not agree
    We give 350m a week to the EU. Let's give it to Dido Harding instead.

  7. #16787
    Established TDF Member jamesp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tim Digger View Post
    I have to say I don't think the decision to urgently discharge elderly people who were mainly awaiting the glacial progress of the social care packages was incorrect, placing any requirement before discharge especially one with ,at the time, limited availability would have continued the situation of no beds available for a significant time, and would have contributed to deaths in corridors and ambulances of those needing urgent care for acute severe covid. The spectre of an overwhelmed NHS was very real and terrifying at the time. That it resulted in infections being brought into residential homes was very sad and not helped by overly stringent belated barrier provisions preventing last moments of farewell. Greatest good greatest number But we were very near the brink.
    The greatest vector for spreading covid locally, was the hospital.

  8. #16788
    Nicotine, valium, vicodin... notdeadyet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Energy58 View Post
    I think that was the most ridiculous waste of money in the whole thing - pure COVID theatre driven by "we must be seen to do something" (something we can report on in the daily dose of doom presser) egged on by the press and the BBC. The only testing worth a damn was that done properly by/for National Statistics which was actually all that was needed because there were no treatments available for anyone with mild symptoms and if you got to the point of needing oxygen it was pretty safe to assume you had it!
    BBC news really showed how poor they've become during it all. The coverage was awful. The whole format of the webpage, the way they'd turned news into a Twitter-like ticker feed, was pure clickbait. There was no attempt to inform or analyse what was going on and certainly no holding the government to account. Exactly the same happening with Ukraine coverage now.

    I came across ABC in Australia's brilliant Coronacast podcast quite early on. That was the perfect example of how public service reporting should have been done. A science journalist and a doctor doing a daily 10 minute briefing on what was going on and a quick analysis of the latest developments. It was so good. Also interesting to hear how other countries were viewing our performance (not good, we were the regular laughing stock even though the doctor was a Brit).

    Another great resource was the weekly Independent SAGE briefings set up by the ex-chair of the official SAGE committee. I don't know why this wasn't more widely broadcast, their analyses were spot on and the committee membership were all top tier people in public health, epidemiology, etc. Presumably because they were so critical of the government. Again, another brilliant example of public service media. Hosts Alice Roberts and Jim Al-Khalili did a great job of engaging the public too.
    Last edited by notdeadyet; 12-07-2022 at 03:35 PM.
    Caliph Hamish Aw-Michty Ay-Ya-Bastard, Spiritual leader of Scottish State in England

  9. #16789
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    [quote
    Last edited by MarkA; 13-07-2022 at 01:54 AM.

  10. #16790
    Established TDF Member Finless's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisch View Post
    Nothing has changed. Idiots take offence at the truth.
    You are, metaphorically, a veritable cornucopia of snide remarks.

    I take it that not all animals would be equal in your vision of the world as it should be?
    Last edited by Finless; 14-07-2022 at 10:16 AM.


 

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