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  • Tim Digger
    Prior Member
    • Feb 2013
    • 5536

    Originally posted by Divemouse
    I just collected an elderly cat from the vet after removal of 4 teeth - she's tripping hard and has the munchies. Why don't people get cat pain killers?
    We tried ketamine but the hallucinations didn't do it for most people. There are always exceptions!! Good analgesic though and the single isomer preparation was showing promise when I retired. Probably found a snag.
    Evolution is great at solving problems. It's the methods that concern me.
    Tim Digger

    Comment

    • nigel hewitt
      Established TDF Member
      • Sep 2013
      • 3199

      Originally posted by Divemouse
      I just collected an elderly cat from the vet after removal of 4 teeth - she's tripping hard and has the munchies. Why don't people get cat pain killers?
      Morphine.
      Couple the syringe to the IV and push the plunger until the pain just goes away.
      Wears of rather fast sadly.
      Helium, because I'm worth it.
      Waterboarding at Guantanamo Bay sounded like a radical holiday opportunity until I looked it up.

      Comment

      • Tim Digger
        Prior Member
        • Feb 2013
        • 5536

        Originally posted by nigel hewitt
        Morphine.
        Couple the syringe to the IV and push the plunger until the pain just goes away.
        Wears of rather fast sadly.
        Morphine is good Diamorphine (Heroin) is better. I have given and recieved both. Oxycodone and alcohol are both good but also have a significant risk of dependence with long term side effects.
        Last edited by Tim Digger; 12-08-2020, 06:27 PM.
        Evolution is great at solving problems. It's the methods that concern me.
        Tim Digger

        Comment

        • Divemouse
          Pedantic Pig
          • Dec 2012
          • 7583

          My Mother had too much morphine in hospital and it seemed to make her aggressively mad. I did enjoy being favourite child for the afternoon though.
          Definitely don't doubt Dawn - not if you value your life

          Comment

          • Paulo
            Established TDF Member
            • Dec 2012
            • 14507

            Originally posted by Tim Digger
            Morphine is good Diamorphine (Heroin) is better. I have given and recieved both. Oxycodone and alcohol are both good but also have a significant risk of dependence with long term side effects.
            Is heroin still something used in medicine?
            If my post doesnt have a typo, then I have probably been hacked!

            Comment

            • Iain Smith
              Established TDF Member
              • Dec 2012
              • 2579

              Originally posted by Paulo
              Is heroin still something used in medicine?
              Yes.

              As Tim said, we call it “diamorphine”.

              Comment

              • Paulo
                Established TDF Member
                • Dec 2012
                • 14507

                Originally posted by Iain Smith
                Yes.

                As Tim said, we call it “diamorphine”.
                When would that be used instead of more regular drugs such as morphine?
                If my post doesnt have a typo, then I have probably been hacked!

                Comment

                • Iain Smith
                  Established TDF Member
                  • Dec 2012
                  • 2579

                  Tim is probably better placed to answer than me - it’s probably 15+ years since I last prescribed it, as part of the then-bundle for acute severe pulmonary oedema due to heart-failure. These days I tend not to have much to do with such patients; they are generally unfit for anaesthesia, thus I don’t get to operate on them...

                  Comment

                  • Tim Digger
                    Prior Member
                    • Feb 2013
                    • 5536

                    It is probably as much about fashion and fear and reputation as about logic and best drug for the job.
                    Diamorphine is Diacetyl morphine, Morphine the parent naturally occurring constituent of opium is chemically altered by a relatively simple process in a way which makes it more lipid soluable, but it is actually inactive until it is de acetylated. This turns it into active monoacetyl morphine this deacetylation can take place in most tissues in a body. By many routes (oral or intramuscular injection) there is little if any difference between morphine and diamorphine as both enter the bloodstream and the brain slowly and levels rise slowly, given intravenously diamorphine acts significantly more quickly as the increased fat solubility allows the high blood concentration to pass into the brain faster where it is deacetylated. This produces the "Rush" a desired effect for some non medical purposes!
                    Also morphine given IV has to be given slowly as it causes the body to release histamine causing an increase in pulse rate which is bad in the circumstances of a heart attack, hence the use of diamorphine described by Ian.
                    Diamorphine is a white powder and is disolved in water or saline before use, morphine is in sterile liquid solution.
                    There are other specialist uses and I could probably write an hours lecture on the subject. So I will stop, the fact is it is a better drug that is limited by it's past history and reputation and is hence illegal in many countries even for medical use.
                    Evolution is great at solving problems. It's the methods that concern me.
                    Tim Digger

                    Comment

                    • Noggin the Nog
                      Hail the Children of LLyr
                      • Jan 2013
                      • 4598

                      So ...... ..... we have quite a crop of large poppy heads in the garden now the flowers have gone. Hmmmmmm.
                      "...are we human, or are we diver?"

                      Comment

                      • Noggin the Nog
                        Hail the Children of LLyr
                        • Jan 2013
                        • 4598

                        A close call. Nearly sent this text message to my 80 yr old mum:-
                        " spent most of the day in the shade trying to drink as much fluid as pissible"

                        Can't edit texts once they're gone.
                        "...are we human, or are we diver?"

                        Comment

                        • jamesp
                          Established TDF Member
                          • Dec 2012
                          • 6095

                          Originally posted by Noggin the Nog
                          A close call. Nearly sent this text message to my 80 yr old mum:-
                          " spent most of the day in the shade trying to drink as much fluid as pissible"

                          Can't edit texts once they're gone.
                          Mine (78), would have laughed.

                          Comment

                          • Divemouse
                            Pedantic Pig
                            • Dec 2012
                            • 7583

                            Mine would have screamed and run away from the magic box with the daemon in it. She wouldn't even answer a landline.
                            Definitely don't doubt Dawn - not if you value your life

                            Comment

                            • nigel hewitt
                              Established TDF Member
                              • Sep 2013
                              • 3199

                              Originally posted by Divemouse
                              Mine would have screamed and run away from the magic box with the daemon in it. She wouldn't even answer a landline.
                              At least it's a response.
                              Mine thought that anything more high-tech than a TV was just 'something other people do'.

                              My mother-in-law was worse
                              One of her sons had to teach her how to write a cheque after her husband died.

                              My father, on the other hand, when confronted with something new first responded with
                              "what does it do?"
                              then
                              "show me."
                              then
                              "let me try"

                              a truly wonderful example to grow up with. The amount of trouble that attitude has got me
                              into over the years is staggering.
                              Helium, because I'm worth it.
                              Waterboarding at Guantanamo Bay sounded like a radical holiday opportunity until I looked it up.

                              Comment

                              • Tim Digger
                                Prior Member
                                • Feb 2013
                                • 5536

                                Originally posted by nigel hewitt
                                At least it's a response.
                                Mine thought that anything more high-tech than a TV was just 'something other people do'.

                                My mother-in-law was worse
                                One of her sons had to teach her how to write a cheque after her husband died.

                                My father, on the other hand, when confronted with something new first responded with
                                "what does it do?"
                                then
                                "show me."
                                then
                                "let me try"

                                a truly wonderful example to grow up with. The amount of trouble that attitude has got me
                                into over the years is staggering.
                                Probably more like "what does it do?"
                                then
                                "show me."
                                then
                                "let me try"
                                then
                                "Where's the screwdriver?"
                                Evolution is great at solving problems. It's the methods that concern me.
                                Tim Digger

                                Comment

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