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  1. #31
    Bananas! Chimp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iain/hsm View Post
    When you do see inside the new MTX range you will be dissapointed. They are all the same internal spares even the latest and greatest MTX range use the same first and second stage service parts
    It the biggest smoke and mirrors milking cash cow of the sport diver the industry has ever seen (In my humble opinion you understand)
    Why would that be disappointing??

    I actually find it very reassuring in this world of ‘change for change-sake’ that Apeks don't feel the need to tinker with the important bits of something that is tried and tested across so many different models for such a long time, and has such a tremendous record of reliability and performance. They already have breathing characteristics that others makers envy (at least when compared on an ANSTI machine) so why spend vast sums re-inventing the wheel to chase a tiny improvement that will be imperceptible to the user, but that may turn out to be a less robust design and compromise the legendary reliability and destroy the hard-won reputation built up over decades? No much of a business model that is it?

    A great many people literally trust their lives to Apeks regs on a regular basis for good reason, and knowing I’m not being used as a test dummy because someone in Aqualung thought it was a good idea to throw the baby out with the bathwater gives me a nice warm feeling when I need it most. Long may the smoke and mirrors continue.
    Believe it or not, bananas do contain a small quantity of Musa Sapientum bananadine, which is a mild, short-lasting psychedelic

  2. #32
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    I see spares commonality as a good thing myself, makes life a bit simpler.

    If only they'd drop the cartel bullshit and sell them openly.

  3. #33
    TDF Member simonhi99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WFO View Post
    I see spares commonality as a good thing myself, makes life a bit simpler.

    If only they'd drop the cartel bullshit and sell them openly.
    Amen to that.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
    Why would that be disappointing??

    I actually find it very reassuring in this world of ‘change for change-sake’ that Apeks don't feel the need to tinker with the important bits of something that is tried and tested across so many different models for such a long time, and has such a tremendous record of reliability and performance. They already have breathing characteristics that others makers envy (at least when compared on an ANSTI machine) so why spend vast sums re-inventing the wheel to chase a tiny improvement that will be imperceptible to the user, but that may turn out to be a less robust design and compromise the legendary reliability and destroy the hard-won reputation built up over decades? No much of a business model that is it?

    A great many people literally trust their lives to Apeks regs on a regular basis for good reason, and knowing I’m not being used as a test dummy because someone in Aqualung thought it was a good idea to throw the baby out with the bathwater gives me a nice warm feeling when I need it most. Long may the smoke and mirrors continue.

    Too much vaguery, you need to be much more specific. Further on the points you do make they are all wrong. My guess is your BSAC

    To kick off

    Quote Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
    A great many people literally trust their lives to Apeks regs on a regular basis for good reason
    Your kidding I cant believe anyone would make such a statement worth a thread all of it's own except no one would stoop so low as to explain it all to you.
    You trust your life to a brand! wow prepare to meet your maker. The whole concept of this thread is that most of us don't trust the brand or the clown in the LDS tinkering at our expense. The whole reason we want genuine spare parts is to inspect to test and to verify in order to take self responsibility.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
    and has such a tremendous record of reliability and performance.
    Apart from all those in trade safety recalls that they have made. I guess you dont talk about them in your reassuring BSAC world. LOL

    Quote Originally Posted by Chimp View Post
    so why spend vast sums re-inventing the wheel to chase a tiny improvement that will be imperceptible to the user, but that may turn out to be a less robust design and compromise the legendary reliability
    And prey tell how you get to make such statement. Methinks you have been talking to too many numpty divers who take all this garbage in from you as Gospel. Others would disagree.

    First its not vast sums of money to design a scuba regulator or to manufacture it for that matter. Sales and marketing take up most of the cost with CE and molding tooling the latter
    But as the current Apeks design rests on a single design given to them free when the T50 came out I guess they made money back.

    One aspect your not considering is all this hold back of future regulator design is because at present they cant, however the restriction of spare parts in the UK to the public are two different questions and this post is only about one of them.

    The lack of availability of genuine spare parts kits with a genuine published retail price is done purely to generate additional money at no cost to Apex Marine and the Aqualung Group to the small independant LDS who sell the main products at lower margin when compared to the big retail box sellers who make an additional retail discount magin at the LDS cost. So in order to compensate the small Independant LDS Apeks took the idea to restrict the spares kits to end users in order for these small LDS to make money at your cost without the supplier Apeks haveing to pay for it.

    Now the big box sellers it is rumered are also going to be offering servicing mail order (box exchange) as they also have the best postage discount rates this will be interesting.
    Non the less you the diver get to pay year after year to suck and blow down a piece of recreation sports equipment serviced by a shop lad on a day course at the factory and with IDEST SITA ASSET Yada Yada waiting in the wings to come out for act II

    Come back with better questions and save your incorrect options until after you learn something. Failing that enjoy the smoke and mirror world while it lasts.
    Last edited by iain/hsm; 18-03-2021 at 10:57 AM.

  5. #35
    TDF Member simonhi99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iain/hsm View Post
    Now the big box sellers it is rumered are also going to be offering servicing mail order (box exchange) as they also have the best postage discount rates this will be interesting.
    Non the less you the diver get to pay year after year to suck and blow down a piece of recreation sports equipment serviced by a shop lad on a day course at the factory and with IDEST SITA ASSET Yada Yada waiting in the wings to come out for act II
    Ok Iain, act II...if the rinky dink LDS shop lad etc. in your opinion, shouldn't be servicing regs etc. Who should be trusted to do it, correctly, reliably and without ripping people off?


    S.
    Simon

  6. #36
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    Dam you apex and the inventor of the wheel. How very dare you not make changes to your working design

  7. #37
    All hail ZOM Woz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonhi99 View Post
    Ok Iain, act II...if the rinky dink LDS shop lad etc. in your opinion, shouldn't be servicing regs etc. Who should be trusted to do it, correctly, reliably and without ripping people off?


    S.
    I had this conversation with him a while back. Didn't really get anywhere. He suggested that every service place should have an ANSTI machine to test each serviced reg but then couldn't tell me what to twiddle on an Apeks reg to adjust it... no doubt he'll be back on saying everyone is a BSAC member and picking this apart line by line...

    Did you know that ANSTI stands for Andy Stan and Ian? Less impressive if you know that.

    Unless you know the chap who services regs and how they work, I'd send them back to Apeks for a service. I've seen the inside of that many badly serviced regs, all clagged up with gobbo and old silicone grease that there are very few places I would send mine. Too many rinky dink slat wall mom and pop places out there that aren't proper hengineers. But there are some bloody good ones too.
    Last edited by Woz; 18-03-2021 at 01:48 PM.
    I have nothing to do with BSAC any more apart from being a muggle member. So anything I write on here is likely to be complete bollocks. Hooray!

  8. #38
    Established TDF Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by simonhi99 View Post
    Ok Iain, act II...if the rinky dink LDS shop lad etc. in your opinion, shouldn't be servicing regs etc. Who should be trusted to do it, correctly, reliably and without ripping people off?
    I am trusted by me to do my own regs.
    Apeks can keep their opinion on the matter to themselves. I just don't like getting ripped off for the parts due to their restrictive practices.

  9. #39
    TDF Member frogman's Avatar
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    Unfortunately, it is not the only Apeks in this dirty business. It is a global "pandemic" involving nearly all scuba manufacturers.
    Last edited by frogman; 18-03-2021 at 03:08 PM.

  10. #40
    Established TDF Member Chrisch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woz View Post
    ....
    Unless you know the chap who services regs and how they work, I'd send them back to Apeks for a service. I've seen the inside of that many badly serviced regs, all clagged up with gobbo and old silicone grease that there are very few places I would send mine. Too many rinky dink slat wall mom and pop places out there that aren't proper hengineers. But there are some bloody good ones too.
    I have to agree - there are some poor standards for service out there, or at least there were. I am lucky with the people round here and have had no problems for a very long time.

    Given the cost of a basic reg I can't see there is that much profit in them if I am honest. I would imagine the shops and manufacturers make their money out of the top end novelty regs which are a triumph of marketing over engineering. A lot of dive gear falls in that category IMHO.
    We give £350m a week to the EU. Let's give it to Dido Harding instead.


 
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