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  1. #41
    Old but keen Mark Chase's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeF View Post
    I tried twin 7's and an offboard 3L of O2 on my alibox in pre GUE JJ days. I did one dive off the boat and said stuff that for the very reasons you quote. underwater it was fine but climbing a ladder or even standing up on a rolling boat was a nightmare.
    Yes thats why I binned the idea 9 years ago

    TBH I also found the unit would role me if I leaned to one side or the other. Fine in flat trim but I was a bit of a wreck ferrit so I was often at odd angles trying to get inside stuff

  2. #42
    Formerly sbc23cam Steve Clark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cathal View Post
    Its advantages are also its weakness. As a unit it is a compromise for every type of diving but its fair to say the primary design architecture is a cave orientated one. As Mark alluded to earlier for a weeks diving say of Malin, most of us would have a couple of different dil's pre-mixed for easy nights. About 2014 I dived regularly with a GUE JJ diver on the Rosguill and another issue not mentioned so far with the unit that he experienced was the extra weight of the unit, he had a lot of difficulty in heavy seas getting across the deck to either jump in or to get back to his spot on the bench. You can imagine what it was like for him half way up the lift when the boat would be hit broadside!! He ended up getting rid of the twin 7's and went back to 3L's for his spines sake. But again that was in open water, in a cave the unit would not have any of these issues.
    The other issue that was raised back then was the fact you have to go off the loop to donate the long hose? I stand to be corrected if this is still the case, would love to hear the rationale behind it.
    Finally, where your buddy is looking for bottom mix if they bail out, because of the back mounted bail out gas you are tied to them on their rather rapid ascent via your long hose as opposed to just handing them the tin.

    Cathal
    Yes, you do have to go on and off the loop to donate. Itís again about the standard response. Immediate problem with buddy - donate whatever is in your mouth. Obviously you canít donate the loop on the JJ or RB80 so the clipped off long hose is next best. It will always be fine, except very shallow.

    Beyond the initial response, the divers can sort out the best solution. This may well be handing over a bottle or fixing whatever the issue was. It would be a bad day in a cave if you were relying on the long hose to get out a long way. It is however a great tool for an instant and safe fix to a cluster fuck.

    GUE never just donate a reg off a clipped off stage bottle. Thereís a fixed procedure for identifying & switching gas and it has killed people when it has been ignored in the past. Itís too slow for rapid donation.

    You are right about the roots being in the cave environment. The GUE JJ CCR is heavy, but it does work in the sea. A standard 3L dil setup & no long hose in a cave is a totally different approach to GUE. Personal vs team solution. Both are valid.

  3. #43
    Formerly sbc23cam Steve Clark's Avatar
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    As for Mark’s comments about logistics, from what I’ve seen the GUE JJ CCR works fine. Just drive it with 15/55 for all wrecks up to 75m. Works fine at 20m if plans change and it’s not like you are going to use much out of 14L.

    That doesn’t work on the RB80. You need the right gas for the dive to keep the ppo2 somewhere near optimal.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Clark View Post

    You are right about the roots being in the cave environment. The GUE JJ CCR is heavy, but it does work in the sea. A standard 3L dil setup & no long hose in a cave is a totally different approach to GUE. Personal vs team solution. Both are valid.
    Thatís not true it was designed by Lundgren who is an ocean wreck diver.

    As for heavier - maybe but itís diveable in its base configuration unlike stock unit which needs a bailout. Add an 80 and lead and the stock is heavier and has no redundancy like the gue config.

    I did 5h of bottom time in malin head over 5-days including a day the other boy didnít go out. I only filled once (230b) and still had enough (170b) dil/bailout ((12/80) for an hour bt in channel. I didnít struggle with weight or logistics once or have to rely on drop bottles as part of my bailout strategy.

    Coffee is waiting In Bournemouth for anybody interested.

  5. #45
    Old but keen Mark Chase's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by graham_hk View Post
    That’s not true it was designed by Lundgren who is an ocean wreck diver.

    As for heavier - maybe but it’s diveable in its base configuration unlike stock unit which needs a bailout. Add an 80 and lead and the stock is heavier and has no redundancy like the gue config.

    I did 5h of bottom time in malin head over 5-days including a day the other boy didn’t go out. I only filled once (230b) and still had enough (170b) dil/bailout ((12/80) for an hour bt in channel. I didn’t struggle with weight or logistics once or have to rely on drop bottles as part of my bailout strategy.

    Coffee is waiting In Bournemouth for anybody interested.

    Just to be clear you were only using the "bailout" to get you to an intermediate gas.

    You would need 50% + 100% bailouts to do the deco on an hours bottom time

    I did an hour on the Audacious and that was only 60-65m and it was about 2.5-3 hours deco.
    Even with my SAC on deco of around 10lpm I still needed 10ltrs 18/45 11ltrs 50% and 10ltrs 80% and they were all blown to 275bar

    Your back gas in the two 7s would get you to 21m easy, but this assumes a non return to shot necessity or at best a not very far away from shot position and of course no nasty c02.

    Unless of course your on teem bailout planning, but I dont take such risks.



    The GUE JJ with two 7s on the back + a 3 of 02 WILL be a heavy unit. Not in the water of course but I bet you were glad when they got a lift on Loyal watcher

  6. #46
    Old but keen Mark Chase's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Clark View Post
    As for Mark’s comments about logistics, from what I’ve seen the GUE JJ CCR works fine. Just drive it with 15/55 for all wrecks up to 75m. Works fine at 20m if plans change and it’s not like you are going to use much out of 14L.

    That doesn’t work on the RB80. You need the right gas for the dive to keep the ppo2 somewhere near optimal.
    If your weeks diveing is all similar depth then I grant it wont matter, but remember even on a CCR dropping the He makes a difference. Diving 65m for an hour on 10/70 gives 25mins more deco than diving the same dive on 13/50 and thats running 80/80GF or 35/100GF

  7. #47
    Old but keen Mark Chase's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Clark View Post
    Yes, you do have to go on and off the loop to donate. It’s again about the standard response. Immediate problem with buddy - donate whatever is in your mouth. Obviously you can’t donate the loop on the JJ or RB80 so the clipped off long hose is next best. It will always be fine, except very shallow.

    Beyond the initial response, the divers can sort out the best solution. This may well be handing over a bottle or fixing whatever the issue was. It would be a bad day in a cave if you were relying on the long hose to get out a long way. It is however a great tool for an instant and safe fix to a cluster fuck.

    GUE never just donate a reg off a clipped off stage bottle. There’s a fixed procedure for identifying & switching gas and it has killed people when it has been ignored in the past. It’s too slow for rapid donation.

    You are right about the roots being in the cave environment. The GUE JJ CCR is heavy, but it does work in the sea. A standard 3L dil setup & no long hose in a cave is a totally different approach to GUE. Personal vs team solution. Both are valid.

    I sat jaw agape when I heard that GUE come off loop to donate.

    Yes yes I get the whole standards thing but it just insane to force the diver with the working unit to come off said working unit on to something which has the risk of not working and in doing so running the risk of rendering your own unit inoperable.

    All just to keep a hog loop???

    Mad

    The rest of the world just donate a long hose straight of a side mounted stage but I suppose GUE heads would explode if they were asked to stuff a hose on the rear mounted 7s All those twinset divers with stuffed hoses they slagged for the last 20 years would crash the internet with their indignation

  8. #48
    GUE Tech and Cave Instructor johnkendall's Avatar
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    It is a bit heavy out of the water, but my wife can manage it happily, so it's not too heavy.

    Yes, we carry deco gases in addition to the back gas, but that's probably only a 7 and a 40. For 100m depth, I add a 3rd deco gas, and below 120 I add a bottom stage too.

    I'll add to Graham's offer, that if anyone near Cambridge wants to see it in the flesh and talk through the whole system then I'll also try and make coffee.

    Thanks
    John

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
    John Kendall
    GUE Instructor Trainer, Tech and Cave Instructor www.johnkendall.com
    www.divinganalysers.com - Nitrox, Trimix and Single Gas Analysers
    www.santi-store.co.uk - Santi Drysuits, Undersuits and Accessories

  9. #49
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    Do GUE JJ's incl an on-board Nespresso, seems to be a bit of a trend.

  10. #50
    GUE Tech and Cave Instructor johnkendall's Avatar
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    I don't drink coffee myself, so I don't promise any kind of quality....

    Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
    John Kendall
    GUE Instructor Trainer, Tech and Cave Instructor www.johnkendall.com
    www.divinganalysers.com - Nitrox, Trimix and Single Gas Analysers
    www.santi-store.co.uk - Santi Drysuits, Undersuits and Accessories


 
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