Neutral bouyancy

[Hot Totty]

Well I've gone and done it, after trialling last season taking non divers and teaching them diving from a perspective of being neutrally buoyant at all times (regardless of skill being taught) I took the plunge and managed to persuade the (active) instructors within my club that this was the way to go. Weymouth and Portland SAC now has a club policy that instructors will teach and demonstrate all in water skills (regardless of water depth) from a position of being neutrally buoyant. We are a BSAC club so if we can do it anyone can, just needs the desire to challenge/change and be at the forefront of a sea change within the dive training organisations (HQ typically bottled on the OD training but have at least started to move on SD and above).

So any divers/instructors wishing to find a progressive club in the Weymouth area to join and dive/instruct with come and find us.

Rik

[drysuitdiver]

I spent 15 mins on the try dives last week getting them neutral , they didn't know thats what I was doing as they were breathing underwater and pressing buttons and releasing air , then they had a great 20 minutes of just moving effortlessly round the pool.

Well done. its something that should be done.

[Hot Totty]

I spent 15 mins on the try dives last week getting them neutral , they didn't know thats what I was doing as they were breathing underwater and pressing buttons and releasing air , then they had a great 20 minutes of just moving effortlessly round the pool.

Well done. its something that should be done.

Exactly, the students don't know any different, it just requires the instructor to buy into the concepts

[Phate]

Good on you. The amount of divers I come across who have umpteen amount of dives but never learned to hover then end up working so hard when diving is worrying/shocking.

Great stuff

[Neilwood]

I think that teaching neutral buoyancy from the start is the correct way to do it. I certainly was trained (by PADI in accordance with the new OW training) with neutral buoyancy - it is now an integral part of the course. Get the principles ingrained at the start and teach the diver to be the best diver they can be from the start and you never have to undo the bad habits.

Teaching students overweighted on the bottom is a lazy way to do it imho and also subconsciously gives the student the thought that being in contact with the sea (or lake) floor is ok ("I did it on my course so it can't be too bad").

[Tens]

Exactly, the students don't know any different, it just requires the instructor to buy into the concepts

Agreed. I always had a few "games" that would teach neutral buoyancy. They don't need to know what you are aiming to teach (maybe until the debrief), but it's important that they don't get bored with same-old, same-old exercises.

[Mikael]

Agreed. I always had a few "games" that would teach neutral buoyancy. They don't need to know what you are aiming to teach (maybe until the debrief), but it's important that they don't get bored with same-old, same-old exercises.

Do please share.

[Hot Totty]

Agreed. I always had a few "games" that would teach neutral buoyancy. They don't need to know what you are aiming to teach (maybe until the debrief), but it's important that they don't get bored with same-old, same-old exercises.

No games, a good brief as to why we will be spending the first and possibly the second scuba pool session aiming to be stationary floating midwater in 1.2m of water. When they can master that with reasonable competence I start to bring skills in, but they are expected to perform the skills stationary (except the finning excersises) and neutral. I'll admit to lifting the bar high initially but it makes everything afterwards so much easier, as to the boredom bit I don't see it they're breathing underwater and it's all new - plus they don't know any different.

The stationary part is quite crucial as it's impossible to mask buoyancy inadequacy if you're not moving, plus in the theory lessons we tell students that if you become entangled in net/line to stop and think - but unless they have been taught to be able to stop (truly stop) then that's not going to be achievable.

[nigel hewitt]

I like it but it should never be the rule nor a condition just a goal.
With ODs I want to see them in safe mode and in the water so we can take them diving an pour good diving practice into them.
I remember how horrible all those mask clearing drills were but for all that I did them kneeling on the bottom the first time I needed it for real was in open water and I just did it.

My other worry is that doing things on the hover needs much more pool space and that is oten at a premium.

[Hot Totty]

I like it but it should never be the rule nor a condition just a goal.
With ODs I want to see them in safe mode and in the water so we can take them diving an pour good diving practice into them.
I remember how horrible all those mask clearing drills were but for all that I did them kneeling on the bottom the first time I needed it for real was in open water and I just did it.

My other worry is that doing things on the hover needs much more pool space and that is oten at a premium.

I understand where your coming from but disagree, there are still too many buoyancy related incidents on the bsac incident reports - the majority of these could have been avoided (imho) if buoyancy control was emphasised right from the start rather than something to try and attain. A to pool space, we share the pool sessions with at least 3 sometimes 4 other agencies (one doing dsd's with kids who seems to think that charging about and taking up a disproportional amount of pool space is acceptable) - my students are able to stop, hover and wait for the wilderbeasts to bugger off before continuing. That to me demonstrates good situational awareness, good control and a calm manner. Can they do this from day one, no it takes time and patience but the rewards are excellent later on as the students appear to be calmer and less likely to panic.

In contrast I had a DL (not trained by me or my club) with an IFC give me and another instructor a full on panic/bolt to the surface when being asked to do mask drills (twice), they also demonstrated a poor level of control over buoyancy with a lack of understanding on weighting. This is what I'm trying to eliminate from the word go rather than have to spend time in remedial sessions later on, this diver wishes to help with instructing so now I have a massive up hill struggle of trying to correct decades of poor technique before even letting them near students.

We have also introduced a system of QA within the instructors so the potential for nepotism is reduced.

[drysuitdiver]

I understand where your coming from but disagree, there are still too many buoyancy related incidents on the bsac incident reports - the majority of these could have been avoided (imho) if buoyancy control was emphasised right from the start rather than something to try and attain. A to pool space, we share the pool sessions with at least 3 sometimes 4 other agencies (one doing dsd's with kids who seems to think that charging about and taking up a disproportional amount of pool space is acceptable) - my students are able to stop, hover and wait for the wilderbeasts to bugger off before continuing. That to me demonstrates good situational awareness, good control and a calm manner. Can they do this from day one, no it takes time and patience but the rewards are excellent later on as the students appear to be calmer and less likely to panic.

In contrast I had a DL (not trained by me or my club) with an IFC give me and another instructor a full on panic/bolt to the surface when being asked to do mask drills (twice), they also demonstrated a poor level of control over buoyancy with a lack of understanding on weighting. This is what I'm trying to eliminate from the word go rather than have to spend time in remedial sessions later on, this diver wishes to help with instructing so now I have a massive up hill struggle of trying to correct decades of poor technique before even letting them near students.

We have also introduced a system of QA within the instructors so the potential for nepotism is reduced.

we rotate the students between the instructors available over the weeks it takes to do the pool stuff. means variety of techniques. I cant do the mask clear the way the BSAC manual describes with hand on mask edge at forehead. i can do it one handed though so show both ways and how what works best/safest for you is whats right.

[Energy58]

I like it but it should never be the rule nor a condition just a goal.
With ODs I want to see them in safe mode and in the water so we can take them diving an pour good diving practice into them.
I remember how horrible all those mask clearing drills were but for all that I did them kneeling on the bottom the first time I needed it for real was in open water and I just did it.

My other worry is that doing things on the hover needs much more pool space and that is oten at a premium.

I just checked the book - the performance standard is able to clear mask/recover reg etc says nothing in the OD course about on the bottom/mid water so I think you are correct that either is OK but with something like DSMB you are supposed to teach it progressively (STEP!) and I am at a loss how to do that starting from mid water!

[Hot Totty]

I suggest you come and pay us a visit then . If the student has the ability to be stationary whilst midwater then they have a stable platform to bring the development of further skills in, if they don't its impossible. All I've done is switch the emphasis around the 'skill' being taught is secondary to the control of their buoyancy, as opposed to currently the 'skill' is primary buoyancy control being secondary - hence all the kneeling on the bottom.

Oh and if you really insist on tying the reel off to the wreck for the first dsmb lesson, this can be done whilst neutrally buoyant

[String]

From my experience teaching neutral makes the first 20-30 minutes of confined messy, occasionally a nightmare but then the OW dives themselves become MUCH easier. If you have a 12ft pool vs a 6ft pool that helps too.
For DSDs and so on i do start in standing depth with partial mask and reg skills kneeling and then we go for a neutral swim around, then back to the skills but this time neutral. The reason i've gone back to that method for the first session is if you dont teach things like partial mask you get half of them surfacing all the time as the mask "got some water in it". By teaching them how to remove that before the swimming they actually stay down and learn. After CW1 its all neutral except for BCD remove/replace which isn't a BSAC skill anyway,

just needs the desire to challenge/change and be at the forefront of a sea change within the dive training organisations (HQ typically bottled on the OD training but have at least started to move on SD and above).

Not sure i'd ever describe BSAC as "at the forefront" for anything its ever done. Neutral buoyancy skills training has been in the SSI syllabus for years and in the PADI OW since the 2012 revisions (although they bottled it, making it highly recommended rather than a standard leaving the door open for the overweight-sink-knee instructors to continue doing the old method, especially in factory places like Koh Tao).

[Hot Totty]

Not sure i'd ever describe BSAC as "at the forefront" for anything its ever done. Neutral buoyancy skills training has been in the SSI syllabus for years and in the PADI OW since the 2012 revisions (although they bottled it, making it highly recommended rather than a standard leaving the door open for the overweight-sink-knee instructors to continue doing the old method, especially in factory places like Koh Tao).

Agree - the agencies bottled it because there not sure the instructor base has the skill to deliver especially within bsac. However to be fair to them they are slowly trying to play catch up - give them decade and it'll be enshrined in the OD manual (bit like nitrox)